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By Declan McCullagh
Posted on ZDNet News: Dec 8, 2005 8:40:00 PM

SAN FRANCISCO--A federal appeals court wrestled Thursday with what seems to be a straightforward question: Can Americans be required to show ID on a commercial airline flight?

John Gilmore, an early employee of Sun Microsystems and co-founder of the Electronic Frontier Foundation, says the answer should be "no." The libertarian millionaire sued the Bush administration, which claims that the ID requirement is necessary for security but has refused to identify any actual regulation requiring it.

Gilmore
John Gilmore

A three-judge panel of the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals seemed skeptical of the Bush administration's defense of secret laws and regulations but stopped short of suggesting that such a rule would be necessarily unconstitutional.

"How do we know there's an order?" Judge Thomas Nelson asked. "Because you said there was?"

Replied Joshua Waldman, a staff attorney for the Department of Justice: "We couldn't confirm or deny the existence of an order." Even though government regulations required his silence, Waldman said, the situation did seem a "bit peculiar."

"This is America," said James Harrison, a lawyer representing Gilmore. "We do not have secret laws. Period." Harrison stressed that Gilmore was happy to go through a metal detector.

Gilmore sued the federal government after being told he could not fly without ID from Oakland, Calif., to Washington, D.C., which he said he was doing to exercise his First Amendment right to petition the government for a redress of grievances. U.S. District Judge Susan Illston dismissed (PDF) his case in March 2004, ruling that Gilmore had "numerous other methods of reaching Washington."

Oral arguments on Thursday, which lasted about 40 minutes, returned repeatedly to that point. Judge Richard Paez suggested that when your ID is requested at an airport, "You can always leave."

Waldman, the Justice Department attorney, said that as long as no commercial airline flight is required, Americans "can assemble wherever they want. They can petition wherever they want." He added, "I'm not aware of any right to travel anonymously."

Two cases that were mentioned on Thursday could provide a glimpse into how the appeals court will rule. In one, decided in 2004, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that police could arrest anyone they stopped who refused to show ID. In the other, U.S. v. Davis, the 9th Circuit said in 1973 that airport searches were permissible as a form of administrative screening.

It's unclear what will happen next. Because of a procedural twist involving lawsuits against federal agencies, the district court concluded that only an appeals court enjoys authority to resolve some aspects of the dispute. But the 9th Circuit judges also could, if they side with Gilmore, send the case back to the lower court for a full trial.

On the courthouse steps after the arguments, Gilmore said he felt confident about the case and welcomed a verbal concession from the Justice Department. "I was glad the government admitted it was 'peculiar' and Orwellian to make secret laws," Gilmore said.

The Justice Department has said it could identify the secret law under seal, which would be available to the 9th Circuit but not necessarily Gilmore's lawyers. But any public description would not be permitted, the department said.

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  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 52 Talkback(s)
Very well put
I do see your point, and I can see your concern. I guess I see it on the very basic level that, as you pointed out, the authorities are not and have not "taken anyone away in cuffs" for not showing ID... (Read the rest)
Posted by: Spoon Jabber Posted on: 12/10/05 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
this is silly  mlevin@... | 12/08/05
On no - I want to know happy  FirstNLastN | 12/08/05
If its not a law, it should be  DarthRidiculous | 12/08/05
It cannot be done.  osreinstall | 12/08/05
true, they are private, but...  bthomasmo@... | 12/08/05
We have a conflict  osreinstall | 12/08/05
Not a conflict, a misunderstanding maybe  Spoon Jabber | 12/08/05
I was referring to the Patriot Act in general terms.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Did you read the article?  B. Short | 12/09/05
Did you read my post?  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
Yes I did Short. Do you understand the consequences?  osreinstall | 12/09/05
yeah dude! Finally!  Jeff Spicoli | 12/09/05
I didn't agree with a lot this Administration did.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
There's a book I'd love for you to read  Jeff Spicoli | 12/09/05
Jeff that isn't too hard to explain  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Freedom of assembly  techboy_z | 12/09/05
Which makes it worse  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Uhhhh, dude!  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
That is what he said and I spelled it out.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
I didn't see it that way  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
I interpreted that way.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
It is difficult....  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
It sure is difficult at times.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Airlines  Middle of the Road | 12/09/05
Even regulations have to pass the Constitutional test.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Common Carrier  Llantha | 12/09/05
Thanks for the input.  bchesmer | 12/09/05
Secret laws ... !  bthomasmo@... | 12/08/05
totally.  mobrien_12@... | 12/09/05
Agree 100%  Real World | 12/09/05
wink  bchesmer | 12/09/05
Id does not matter .... we are all stupid!  rem1010 | 12/08/05
Secret Laws - Since When Did the US Become Soviet Russia  Edward Meyers | 12/08/05
Simmer down now!  Spoon Jabber | 12/08/05
Not a relevant example ...  B. Short | 12/09/05
Agreed.  bthomasmo@... | 12/09/05
TADA!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!  Jeff Spicoli | 12/09/05
BINGO!  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
Ummm dude..  Jeff Spicoli | 12/09/05
Simple  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
WRONG!!!! Did you fail to read the entire article?  bchesmer | 12/09/05
Maybe I'm not clear  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
What bout this....  bchesmer | 12/09/05
That is it exactly!  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
Not the same.  bchesmer | 12/09/05
But....you just agreed with me....?  Spoon Jabber | 12/09/05
Sorry, but no....  bchesmer | 12/09/05
Very well put  Spoon Jabber | 12/10/05
That's not a law  mobrien_12@... | 12/09/05
Secret Laws and the Constitution  Update victim | 12/09/05
That will not work.  osreinstall | 12/09/05
Airport I checks  Peter Bruno | 12/09/05

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