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By Tom Espiner , ZDNet (UK)
Posted on ZDNet News: Nov 28, 2007 5:21:00 AM

Lawyers for plaintiffs in a case brought against Microsoft over Vista's marketing have claimed that even the software giant's marketing director was confused by the prelaunch campaign in the U.S.

The case involves the way Microsoft marketed PCs as "Windows Vista capable" prior to the consumer launch of the operating system in January.

Plaintiffs Dianne Kelley and Kenneth Hansen claim Microsoft was not telling the truth when it put the "Vista capable" logo on PCs that would be capable of running only Vista Home Basic. They contend that "Vista capable" implies that the machine is able to run all versions of Vista, rather than just the pared-down Home Basic version.

In a filing for a class action at the U.S. district court in Seattle earlier this month, lawyers acting for the plaintiffs claimed that even Microsoft's director of marketing, Mark Croft, had become confused about the meaning of "Vista capable" when giving evidence.

Croft's explanation was that "'capable' has an interpretation for many that, in the context of this program, a PC would be able to run any version of the Windows operating system."

"Ready," Croft continued, "may (cause) concerns that the PC would run in some improved or better way than 'capable.'"

After a 10-minute break to talk to Microsoft's lawyers, Croft admitted he had made "an error" and retracted his previous statement, saying that by "capable" Microsoft meant "able to run a version of Vista."

In the filing, the plaintiffs' lawyers said that it was "ironic" Croft had made the mistake. "Mr. Croft understood Microsoft's logo to be telling customers that PCs would run not only the stripped-down Vista Home Basic, but also what plaintiffs contend are the 'real' versions of Vista: the ones that include Microsoft's heavily marketed 'Vista features.' Ironically, Mr. Croft's understanding of what 'Windows Vista capable' means is the same understanding that Microsoft asserts no consumer would be justified in having."

In a court filing of its own, Microsoft argues that it, along with computer makers and the press, educated consumers about Vista and the meaning of the term Windows Vista Capable.

"Plaintiffs ignore the comprehensive marketing campaigns through which Microsoft, OEMs, retailers and others provided consumers with detailed information on the different versions of Windows Vista and the 'Windows Vista Capable' program," Microsoft said in the filing. "Instead, plaintiffs focus on the tiny three-word logo that played only a small role in that process."

It also argues that the case should not be allowed to be a class action on behalf of those who took part in the Express Upgrade program for Vista because the named plaintiff in the suit did not take part in that program, which gave a free or nearly free copy of Vista to buyers of XP machines in the months before the newer OS came to market.

The Seattle-based law firm acting for the plaintiffs--Gordon, Tilden, Thomas & Cordell--is seeking to prove that Microsoft developed its "Windows Vista capable" marketing program, including the logo and the "express upgrade to Windows Vista" promotion, to maintain Windows XP sales prior to the launch of Vista.

Microsoft is fighting the claim. The software company claims that itself, OEMs, retailers and the press had informed consumers about what "Vista capable" meant.

Tom Espiner of ZDNet UK reported from London. CNET News.com's Ina Fried contributed to this report from San Francisco.

©2007 CNET Networks, Inc. All rights reserved. CNET , CNET.com , and the CNET logo are registered trademarks of CNET Networks, Inc. Used by permission.

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  • Most Recent of 113 Talkback(s)
Instructed by lawyers????
Hay, Everybody know lawyers and politicians are the most reprehensible and mince mouthed out there and the lawyers knew what "Vista capable" means. AND every one knows that to get to the top in a corporation is all politics.

Go figure!... (Read the rest)
Posted by: Red Elk Posted on: 12/12/07 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
That about says it all, no?  Henaway | 11/28/07
The Terrible Truth About Lawyers  Tony R. | 11/30/07
Lawyers are irrelevant  notsofast | 11/30/07
Instructed by lawyers????  Red Elk | 12/12/07
Why can't Vista Ultimate run on low end PCs?  NonZealot | 11/28/07
The problem is in the marketing  tikigawd | 11/28/07
Confusing? Yes. Deceptive? No.  NonZealot | 11/28/07
Hmm...  BlazingEagle | 11/28/07
Deceptive  brichter | 11/28/07
"as shown"  springerj | 11/28/07
DON'T UPGRADE OS  wjkahlssmd@... | 11/29/07
I have to disagree  alaniane@... | 11/29/07
Vista Ultimate CAN run on any entry-level ...  mwagner@... | 11/28/07
A poor apoligist is better than no apologist  Ole Man | 11/28/07
Then this suit has no merit  NonZealot | 11/28/07
Incorrect Assumption that Vista Capable Computers  danm50 | 11/28/07
You state The Obvious Without Realizing It  russell_john@... | 11/28/07
Nope, suit makes sense  macoafi | 11/28/07
But not on those sold 2 years ago during this advertising campaign.  maschwab@... | 11/28/07
Can't do it.  jheine | 11/29/07
I smell a scam.  Raymond Danner | 12/02/07
It was the wrong focus  TripleII | 11/28/07
This I agree with  NonZealot | 11/28/07
Respectfully disagree.  Raymond Danner | 12/02/07
low end machine  jogilvie@... | 11/28/07
That way, all computers would be Vista Ready..er not really  macoafi | 11/28/07
When a "Vista Capable" E-Machine is actually not...  jaybyrd | 11/28/07
You're Just An Incompetent Fool  itanalyst | 11/28/07
Quit Being So Cheap  russell_john@... | 11/28/07
Good, sue em  Boot_Agnostic | 11/28/07
A computer may be Vista capable,  jorjitop | 11/28/07
Slight correction  NonZealot | 11/28/07
What a way to talk about Vista!  Ole Man | 11/28/07
Another correction  macoafi | 11/28/07
I can't seem  alaniane@... | 11/29/07
Do something about the lawyers  pzw@... | 11/28/07
Right, for all those stupid  legalista | 11/28/07
pidgeons  reedjjjr | 11/28/07
I have been assured that  mhenriday | 11/28/07
Re: Do something about the lawyers  bfilipiak@... | 11/28/07
Leaching???????  Clueless Jim | 12/06/07
uuhmmmm, maybe you MISSED the part  1stcyberian | 11/28/07
Windows Vista should have been offered as just an OS  rolnmrbl@... | 11/28/07
Worse than ME  madrucke@... | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  jags_mcp@... | 11/28/07
Minimum Requirements  tmsassoc | 11/28/07
This totally Fable  windozefreak | 11/28/07
Part of the problem  alaniane@... | 11/29/07
Agreed.  zach.winchester | 11/28/07
Another Microsoft-funded post  Ole Man | 11/28/07
But the ID-10T errors are invariably M$'s, not the consumers...  1stcyberian | 11/28/07
Smug self Satisfaction  greybeardtechie | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  mwagner@... | 11/28/07
I'm certainly confused by your statement  mdsock@... | 11/28/07
No one Is Asking You To be Brilliant  windozefreak | 11/28/07
Microsoft doesn't even ask you to be cautious...  kingmph@... | 11/28/07
The point is  seanferd | 11/29/07
The leg to stand on, technically speaking  Ole Man | 11/28/07
vista capable? yep.  jeyost@... | 11/29/07
BUWAHAHAHH!!! - No Comment From Bitty???  itanalyst | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  smgtfg@... | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  Runtime_Error | 11/28/07
Glad I have not Purchased Vista!  jimc52@... | 11/28/07
Vista was intended to weed out  Ole Man | 11/28/07
It all depends on what your definition of 'is' is...  1stcyberian | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  RickWilliams@... | 11/28/07
Customer decides not Courts, Lawyers or microsoft.  echodelta@... | 11/28/07
I agree.  rickierbyers@... | 11/28/07
Ditto  Headspin | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  rhochstedler@... | 11/28/07
MICROSOFT IS A GREAT COMPANY!! People need to lay off!  erniem1970@... | 11/28/07
EVERYBODY HEAR'S YOU  Ole Man | 11/28/07
Such a Wonderful Company  Cardhu | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  nusak1953@... | 11/28/07
Don't Give Up on Vista!  hinkel@... | 11/28/07
For sure! For sure!  Ole Man | 11/28/07
re:Don't Give Up on Vista!  tw_cook | 11/28/07
Lawyers confused about lawyers  PhilippeV | 11/28/07
Sound just like Congressmen, don't they?  Ole Man | 11/28/07
Various Flavors, capabilities  DonG43 | 11/28/07
Basically, yes  seanferd | 11/29/07
LOL, take your meds! happy  RealNonZealot | 11/28/07
What about the short life of the "free upgrade" offer?  leegee | 11/28/07
It was available for a limited time  seanferd | 11/28/07
Sony Suck  leegee | 12/05/07
I'm not a lawyer. but I did stay at Disney Land  sykandtyed | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  jogilvie@... | 11/28/07
not smart consumers  jogilvie@... | 11/28/07
They Bought The Cheapest PCs On The Market  russell_john@... | 11/28/07
cheapest pc  jogilvie@... | 11/28/07
I've Been Running Vista For 6 Months  russell_john@... | 11/28/07
Sorry, it is MS who instituted Windows Logo Testing.  seanferd | 11/28/07
What happened to the old labelling system?  seanferd | 11/28/07
Capable and Premium Ready PCs  seanferd | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  SentryWatch | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  phatkat | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  dragonmago@... | 11/28/07
Lets face it  ben.rattigan | 11/29/07
You need a super-computer...  tek_heretik | 11/29/07
Confusing Comments  Nemo1 | 11/29/07
Nicely Stated. (NT)  seanferd | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  wadneyare@... | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  paulhinz | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  only1pj | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft  leeepson7800 | 11/29/07
Go Linux or Mac  eschmeltzer | 11/29/07
Deceptive indeed  John Musbach | 11/29/07
It's dead simple to prove who's right/wrong...  nil_bazana@... | 11/30/07
Try any of the hundred Linux distros instead  Boot_Agnostic | 11/30/07
Its called choice, but if you need advice on which to choose..  g2g591 | 11/30/07
Use it  Boot_Agnostic | 12/03/07
People will try anything for a buck  walsten11@... | 11/30/07
Nah, you have to change the laws  Boot_Agnostic | 12/10/07

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