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By Tom Espiner, ZDNet (UK)
Posted on ZDNet News: Nov 28, 2007 5:21:00 AM

Lawyers for plaintiffs in a case brought against Microsoft over Vista's marketing have claimed that even the software giant's marketing director was confused by the prelaunch campaign in the U.S.

The case involves the way Microsoft marketed PCs as "Windows Vista capable" prior to the consumer launch of the operating system in January.

Plaintiffs Dianne Kelley and Kenneth Hansen claim Microsoft was not telling the truth when it put the "Vista capable" logo on PCs that would be capable of running only Vista Home Basic. They contend that "Vista capable" implies that the machine is able to run all versions of Vista, rather than just the pared-down Home Basic version.

In a filing for a class action at the U.S. district court in Seattle earlier this month, lawyers acting for the plaintiffs claimed that even Microsoft's director of marketing, Mark Croft, had become confused about the meaning of "Vista capable" when giving evidence.

Croft's explanation was that "'capable' has an interpretation for many that, in the context of this program, a PC would be able to run any version of the Windows operating system."

"Ready," Croft continued, "may (cause) concerns that the PC would run in some improved or better way than 'capable.'"

After a 10-minute break to talk to Microsoft's lawyers, Croft admitted he had made "an error" and retracted his previous statement, saying that by "capable" Microsoft meant "able to run a version of Vista."

In the filing, the plaintiffs' lawyers said that it was "ironic" Croft had made the mistake. "Mr. Croft understood Microsoft's logo to be telling customers that PCs would run not only the stripped-down Vista Home Basic, but also what plaintiffs contend are the 'real' versions of Vista: the ones that include Microsoft's heavily marketed 'Vista features.' Ironically, Mr. Croft's understanding of what 'Windows Vista capable' means is the same understanding that Microsoft asserts no consumer would be justified in having."

In a court filing of its own, Microsoft argues that it, along with computer makers and the press, educated consumers about Vista and the meaning of the term Windows Vista Capable.

"Plaintiffs ignore the comprehensive marketing campaigns through which Microsoft, OEMs, retailers and others provided consumers with detailed information on the different versions of Windows Vista and the 'Windows Vista Capable' program," Microsoft said in the filing. "Instead, plaintiffs focus on the tiny three-word logo that played only a small role in that process."

It also argues that the case should not be allowed to be a class action on behalf of those who took part in the Express Upgrade program for Vista because the named plaintiff in the suit did not take part in that program, which gave a free or nearly free copy of Vista to buyers of XP machines in the months before the newer OS came to market.

The Seattle-based law firm acting for the plaintiffs--Gordon, Tilden, Thomas & Cordell--is seeking to prove that Microsoft developed its "Windows Vista capable" marketing program, including the logo and the "express upgrade to Windows Vista" promotion, to maintain Windows XP sales prior to the launch of Vista.

Microsoft is fighting the claim. The software company claims that itself, OEMs, retailers and the press had informed consumers about what "Vista capable" meant.

Tom Espiner of ZDNet UK reported from London. CNET News.com's Ina Fried contributed to this report from San Francisco.

©2007 CNET Networks, Inc. All rights reserved. CNET , CNET.com , and the CNET logo are registered trademarks of CNET Networks, Inc. Used by permission.

  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 113 Talkback(s)
Instructed by lawyers????
Hay, Everybody know lawyers and politicians are the most reprehensible and mince mouthed out there and the lawyers knew what "Vista capable" means. AND every one knows that to get to the top in a corporation is all politics.

Go figure!... (Read the rest)
Posted by: redelk2@... Posted on: 12/12/07 You are currently: Logged In | Log out
That about says it all, no? Henaway   | 11/28/07
The Terrible Truth About Lawyers Andrew P.   | 11/30/07
Lawyers are irrelevant notsofast   | 11/30/07
Instructed by lawyers???? redelk2@...   | 12/12/07
Why can't Vista Ultimate run on low end PCs? NonZealot   | 11/28/07
The problem is in the marketing tikigawd   | 11/28/07
Confusing? Yes. Deceptive? No. NonZealot   | 11/28/07
Hmm... blazeeagle@...   | 11/28/07
Deceptive brichter   | 11/28/07
"as shown" springerj   | 11/28/07
DON'T UPGRADE OS wjkahlssmd@...   | 11/29/07
I have to disagree alaniane@...   | 11/29/07
Vista Ultimate CAN run on any entry-level ... mwagner@...  ZDNet | 11/28/07
A poor apoligist is better than no apologist Ole Man   | 11/28/07
Then this suit has no merit NonZealot   | 11/28/07
Incorrect Assumption that Vista Capable Computers danm50   | 11/28/07
You state The Obvious Without Realizing It russell_john@...   | 11/28/07
Nope, suit makes sense macoafi   | 11/28/07
But not on those sold 2 years ago during this advertising campaign. maschwab@...   | 11/28/07
Can't do it. jheine   | 11/29/07
I smell a scam. Raymond Danner   | 12/02/07
It was the wrong focus TripleII   | 11/28/07
This I agree with NonZealot   | 11/28/07
Respectfully disagree. Raymond Danner   | 12/02/07
low end machine jogilvie@...   | 11/28/07
That way, all computers would be Vista Ready..er not really macoafi   | 11/28/07
When a "Vista Capable" E-Machine is actually not... jaybyrd   | 11/28/07
You're Just An Incompetent Fool itanalyst   | 11/28/07
Quit Being So Cheap russell_john@...   | 11/28/07
Good, sue em Boot_Agnostic   | 11/28/07
A computer may be Vista capable, jorjitop   | 11/28/07
Slight correction NonZealot   | 11/28/07
What a way to talk about Vista! Ole Man   | 11/28/07
Another correction macoafi   | 11/28/07
I can't seem alaniane@...   | 11/29/07
Do something about the lawyers pzw@...   | 11/28/07
Right, for all those stupid legalista   | 11/28/07
pidgeons reedjjjr   | 11/28/07
I have been assured that mhenriday   | 11/28/07
Re: Do something about the lawyers bfilipiak@...   | 11/28/07
Leaching??????? Clueless Jim   | 12/06/07
uuhmmmm, maybe you MISSED the part 1stcyberian   | 11/28/07
Windows Vista should have been offered as just an OS rolnmrbl@...   | 11/28/07
Worse than ME madrucke@...   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft jags_mcp@...   | 11/28/07
Minimum Requirements tmsassoc   | 11/28/07
This totally Fable zulubuck   | 11/28/07
Part of the problem alaniane@...   | 11/29/07
Agreed. zach.winchester   | 11/28/07
Another Microsoft-funded post Ole Man   | 11/28/07
But the ID-10T errors are invariably M$'s, not the consumers... 1stcyberian   | 11/28/07
Smug self Satisfaction greybeardtechie   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft mwagner@...  ZDNet | 11/28/07
I'm certainly confused by your statement mdsock@...   | 11/28/07
No one Is Asking You To be Brilliant zulubuck   | 11/28/07
Microsoft doesn't even ask you to be cautious... kingmph@...   | 11/28/07
The point is seanferd   | 11/29/07
The leg to stand on, technically speaking Ole Man   | 11/28/07
vista capable? yep. jeyost@...   | 11/29/07
BUWAHAHAHH!!! - No Comment From Bitty??? itanalyst   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft smgtfg@...   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft Runtime_Error   | 11/28/07
Glad I have not Purchased Vista! jimc52@...   | 11/28/07
Vista was intended to weed out Ole Man   | 11/28/07
It all depends on what your definition of 'is' is... 1stcyberian   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft RickWilliams@...   | 11/28/07
Customer decides not Courts, Lawyers or microsoft. echodelta@...   | 11/28/07
I agree. rickierbyers@...   | 11/28/07
Ditto Headspin   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft rhochstedler@...   | 11/28/07
MICROSOFT IS A GREAT COMPANY!! People need to lay off! erniem1970@...   | 11/28/07
EVERYBODY HEAR'S YOU Ole Man   | 11/28/07
Such a Wonderful Company Cardhu   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft nusak1953@...   | 11/28/07
Don't Give Up on Vista! hinkel@...   | 11/28/07
For sure! For sure! Ole Man   | 11/28/07
re:Don't Give Up on Vista! tw_cook   | 11/28/07
Lawyers confused about lawyers PhilippeV   | 11/28/07
Sound just like Congressmen, don't they? Ole Man   | 11/28/07
Various Flavors, capabilities DonG43   | 11/28/07
Basically, yes seanferd   | 11/29/07
LOL, take your meds! :-) RealNonZealot   | 11/28/07
What about the short life of the "free upgrade" offer? leegee   | 11/28/07
It was available for a limited time seanferd   | 11/28/07
Sony Suck leegee   | 12/05/07
I'm not a lawyer. but I did stay at Disney Land RUlistening   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft jogilvie@...   | 11/28/07
not smart consumers jogilvie@...   | 11/28/07
They Bought The Cheapest PCs On The Market russell_john@...   | 11/28/07
cheapest pc jogilvie@...   | 11/28/07
I've Been Running Vista For 6 Months russell_john@...   | 11/28/07
Sorry, it is MS who instituted Windows Logo Testing. seanferd   | 11/28/07
What happened to the old labelling system? seanferd   | 11/28/07
Capable and Premium Ready PCs seanferd   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft SentryWatch   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft phatkat   | 11/28/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft dragonmago@...   | 11/28/07
Lets face it ben.rattigan   | 11/29/07
You need a super-computer... tek_heretik   | 11/29/07
Confusing Comments Nemo1   | 11/29/07
Nicely Stated. (NT) seanferd   | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft wadneyare@...   | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft paulhinz   | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft only1pj   | 11/29/07
RE: Lawyers: Vista branding confused even Microsoft leeepson7800   | 11/29/07
Go Linux or Mac eschmeltzer   | 11/29/07
Deceptive indeed John Musbach   | 11/29/07
It's dead simple to prove who's right/wrong... nil_bazana@...   | 11/30/07
Try any of the hundred Linux distros instead Boot_Agnostic   | 11/30/07
Its called choice, but if you need advice on which to choose.. g2g591   | 11/30/07
Use it Boot_Agnostic   | 12/03/07
People will try anything for a buck walsten11@...   | 11/30/07
Nah, you have to change the laws Boot_Agnostic   | 12/10/07

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